Filmmakers: Franziska von Rosen and Douglas von Rosen, Pinegrove Productions

_{The following interview is with Elder Georgina Doucette of Eskissoqnik (Eskasoni) First Nation in Cape Breton, Nova Scotia on January 2006. It was conducted by Trudy Sable and Franziska von Rosen for the Native Dance Project, Carleton University, CIRCLE Institute, to document Indigenous dances throughout Canada (native-dance.ca).  The filming was done by Franziska and Douglas von Rosen, Pinegrove Productions. Portions of the interview have been uploaded to the Native Dance website (native-dance.ca).} 

_{Sponsorship for the archiving of this interview is through the Mi’kmaw Native Friendship Centre in Halifax, Nova Scotia, with funding through the Department of Canadian Heritage, Aboriginal Languages Initiative Program.}

 _{[FVR & DVR discussing how to set up the shoot]}

_{FZ:            Oh, look at this.}

_{TS:            When did you make mine?}

_{FZ:            Look at those lovely outfits!}

_{GD:           And I couldn’t do hand-embroidery. You did that yourself (speaking to Ruby Doucette, her daughter)}

_{RD:           I embroidered it myself}

_{FVR:         That’s beautiful}

_{TS:            I had forgotten that shawl, Ruby. I’ve seen you dance so many times, but for some reason, I thought it was a red shawl}

_{GD:           She had a red shawl}

_{TS:           Ok, thank you!}

_{GD:          No?}

_{RD:          … and royal blue and yellow}

_{TS:           I’m going to go look on the videotape}

_{GD:          I’m sure}

_{TS:            You thought so? I did too, I thought it was red, with a star on the back}

_{GD:           Unless it’s what’s her name’s –}

_{RD:           It was royal blue, and it had the four colours and eight-point star. I gave it to Donna.}

_{TS:            You put a wolf on the back of mine (laughing).}

_{GD:           You didn’t feel like a wolf?}

_{GD:           Were you over at Doctor Granny’s, Trudy? [measuring & marking shawl] Will it be this quiet all through?}

_{TS:            That’s where I am staying.}

_{DVR:         You’re here by yourself}

_{GD:           Oh God, you’re never alone, sir (laughing). (sound of cutting cloth) I had to pick the worst scissors to work with. (silence)  This might be a shawl for Rebecca. Guess I can’t squeeze in there. [Sound of sewing machine continues to sew without speaking.]}

_{TS:            So, who are you making this shawl for?}

_{GD:           Ah, I think this one is gonna be for Rebecca, my granddaughter. I wasn’t going to do one for her just yet, because I wanted her to try out red, the colour red, because I think she would look good in red. But since you’re here, and – maybe that’s the colour she needs. (chuckling)}

_{TS:            Is that how you usually decide, when someone asks you about the colour of a shawl, or do they tell you?}

_{GD:           They usually have their own idea of what they want. I just don’t make shawls, just to make them. People have to order them. They do it for spiritual reasons and healing purposes, like a young girl coming out of a rehab, like all them drug centers. They usually come over and they have colours that somebody has given them, a spiritual healer, and they’ll order in that order, what works for them, spiritually.}

_{TS:            So, a healer actually suggests certain colours that will help heal them. Is that what you’re saying?}

_{GD:           Yeah.}

_{TS:            What are the different…do you know much about what colours, what kind of healing they have?}

_{GD:           Well, purple I know is a healing colour. I just talked to a lady last week, last Sunday, and she wanted a quilt done in three shades of purple. She’s going for cancer surgery at the end of the month, and she wants them colours. And with the White Bear on it, so, that’s medicine.}

_{TS:            So, people come with usually an idea of something that something… Either they’ve been given an idea, or something that will help heal them and…}

_{GD:           Yes, or some women will go on a fast, just a healing, like you would with the survivors of residential school. They go to a lot of these healing practices, like around people. They hold these healing ceremonies either in a teepee or a sweat lodge, or some people go on a fast. Some women go on a fast, and they get their colours and they get their spirit guide. That’s how it usually works}

_{TS:           Now you made one for Sarah Denny as well. Did she come to you and ask you to make one, or was that a different situation?}

_{GD:           A shawl, I made for my Aunt Sarah? That was a totally different situation. [laughs softly] I wanted to do that for her}

_{TS:            As a gift you mean?}

_{GD:          As a gift, yeah.}

_{TS:           What colour and symbol did you put on it?}

_{GD:           I put an eagle on hers, and it was all done in little piecework, like I would do in my quilts, you know those little diamonds? Well, that’s how her shawl was.}

_{TS:            I heard yesterday that it was with her when she was buried. They put it around her.}

_{GD:           Yes}

_{TS:            So it sounds like it became a special shawl for her. Would that be accurate, do you think, to say?}

_{GD:           I think so, yes. She was an incredible woman. She opened a lot of eyes amongst the younger generation. Long before being a Native was popular, Sarah and her husband and children were practicing culture. So, I think they deserve a lot of credit and recognition. She was an incredible person.}

_{TS:            So, did you decide an eagle was the best way to express her power or whatever?}

_{GD:           Yes, it was her}

_{TS:           And you also made a shawl for me![ [laughs] Should I ask [laughing], why you chose a wolf? Was that you, or Vaughan?}

_{GD:           It probably was Vaughan, I think. I’m not sure.}

_{TS:            But, sometimes people have ideas for other people is what I am trying to ask.}

_{GD:           Yeah, most people}

_{TS:           So, somebody might come to you and ask for a gift for somebody.}

_{GD:          Umhm}

_{TS:            Well, can you tell me when you started making shawls, or why you started making shawls?}

_{GD:           I started about…when it was my own personal healing, that started me to making regalia and quilts, and I started about 18 or 19 years ago. I needed to be healed, and there was no other way that I could do it. And I think at that time I was so overwhelmed by my dysfunctional life. You know, when I started, oh my God, I didn’t think I’d survive the first three months, [laughing] but I pulled through. I said to myself, “If I’m gonna get healed, I’m gonna have to have somebody else too. I can’t go this road by myself, I need a lot o support. So, I called people and I had people pray for me, and then the sweat lodge happened into my world, and I asked people that were going to sweats to pray for me. So, 19 years later, I’m still sober [laughing]}

_{TS:            How did the shawls become part of your healing? Where did that enter your healing process?}

_{GD:           That entered into my world. It was part of what was going on in our communities, and I started making regalia because… I think Donna Augustine might have been one of the first women to ask me to make a shawl for her, and I did that, and next thing you know I was doing it for a living [laughing]. I started off just to do it as more of a healing to try and encourage people to get back to their culture. And it had a lot to do with how you felt when you wore Native regalia, because I hear women saying they feel differently when they dance and when they have a regalia. They feel they’re Mi’kmaw, and that they’re not wearing anything from Wal-Mart, but something that’s made by a Mi’kmaw woman, and it makes them feel good. And I say, if a simple shawl could do that for a person when you’re fighting addictions, you know, can you imagine how good you’d feel if you went dancin’ and you had your own regalia. You’d know who you were, instead of what somebody else tells you that you are.}

_{TS:            Do you make other pieces as well, of regalia…shirts, ribbon shirts. I see a lot of ribbon shirts.}

_{GD:           I do a lot of ribbon shirts, mostly for dancers, male dancers. I was hoping to get into leather, start working with leather, but people – I hear women saying it’s too hot, so they prefer the Wal-Mart fabric [laughing]. I guess it’s ok for winter, or if you have any winter ceremonies or gatherings, it’ll be good then. And most people just enjoy something that’s cool, umhm}

_{TS:           Are shawls part of the Mi’kmaw traditional outfits?}

_{GD:           Umhm. I guess even men wore like a blanket or something. Yeah, I guess everybody did wear something around them, either furs or some sort of skin}

_{TS:            It’s interesting, I’ve been thinking it was something that was brought from the west, people going west and studying, and coming back, but you and Joel both are talking about it more as a carryover from…}

_{GD:           Yeah, a carryover from –}

_{TS:            Skins or blankets}

_{GD:           Yeah. So I guess what we have out west, and what’s down here, and we’re all one nation. We can’t be all you know, different, that much different. I guess years ago, everybody travelled anyway, all over. What you had, you shared, including knowledge. Plenty of that today but hardly anybody shares it, you know? You have to know the right people to learn something. [laughs]]}

_{TS:            People like you}

_{TS:           Do you have your own shawl?}

_{GD:           Not yet. [TS: You never make yourself one?]  No, every time I start to, something always comes up. Somebody always wants something, and I can’t do it all.}

_{TS:            If you were to make your own shawl, what would it be?}

_{GD:           I would be all in yellow, mustard yellow. [laughing] I love yellow, and I think I would choose yellow, yellow regalia.}

_{TS:            Would you put any particular animal or design on it?}

_{GD:           Mm, turtle}

_{TS:            Because?}

_{GD:           Because I’m Grandmother Turtle, yeah. That was given to me by a healer. But before I got that name, I always wondered why I was so attached to the turtle. Remember the turtle I had on my floor upstairs? [TS: Yeah, I do.] And, I made a turtle blanket or somebody ordered a turtle blanket. When I finished it, I didn’t want to give it up}

_{TS:           What is it about turtles?}

_{GD:           I don’t know. [laughing]}

_{TS ”           I never knew why it was called Turtle Island. I always wondered, why Turtle Island?}

_{GD”           Yeah}

_{TS”            Because they’re so old, and kind of ancient, and they carry stuff on their backs? What do you think?}

_{GD:           So humble.}

_{TS:           Is that why, do you think?}

_{GD:           I think so. And why would you think they last so long? Because they’re wise [laughing]. And I don’t think they pollute their environment.}

_{TS:            Is there anything else you’d like to share with us? It’s been so rich already. [GD and TS laugh together]}

_{GD:           Well}

_{TS:            Do you think you’ll be doing this ‘til your dying days?}

_{GD:           I think so. I wish my granddaughters would get into it. Some are, but I would like to see them more involved in our community. I started this off as part of helping me and helping others to pull the community together because there was so much alcohol and drugs on reserve. And it’s not just on the reserves, it’s all over the world, you know. But I guess it helps if you know where you came from, to know where you’re gonna go, and I wanna see my grandchildren go in that direction, where they wouldn’t have to suffer needlessly, you know. I keep telling them, “Everything is within you. Bring it out!”}

_{TS:            Dance it out.}

_{GD:           Dance it out! [laughing] Yeah, life could be interesting}

_{FVR:         I’d love to hear you once more, just to tell us in your own words, what it meant to you to make that shawl for your Auntie Sarah. Please tell me that experience one more time if you would}

_{GD:           I wanted to give her something special. She’s done so much. It’s like every community…it’s just not here, but in every community, I guess, it happens all over, that we don’t really know what we have, until it’s gone, or somebody passes on, then people begin to realize this person was great, or your own community sometimes recognizes you the last. Like I talked to Rita Joe one time about this. Remember when she got the Order of Canada award? Her and I talked on that. I was at her… they were givin’ her a party, dinner and recognition, finally. And she told me this is the last place that ever recognized her or paid homage to her. She said she’s been all over the place and got all kinds of recognition from other people, and that made me think. So, what I did for my Aunt Sarah, you know…I found her a special person because she did so much, and I would’ve liked to seen her recognized in some way, so I did that for her; in my own way, that’s all I could do. I couldn’t throw her a big party [laughing] but I always told her I thought highly of her. Everybody needs to be appreciated.}

_{TS:            What are these?}

_{GD:           Leggings.}

_{TS:            Oh, I see}

_{GD:          Oh, you should see Leah’s leggings. They’re all leather. She’s doing her regalia in leather, and they’re all beaded. She’s got a turtle on there}

_{TS:           Did you ever do beadwork?}

_{GD:           I tried, but I just don’t have the vision, you know. You have to have good eyesight. I can’t even sew anymore at night, the way I used to. I used to be able to sew right up until 11:00 or 12 o’clock at night}

_{TS:            Just your eyes?}

_{GD:           Yes}

_{TS:            That’s going to be something in the wind and sun}

_{GD:           It would look good with yellow, wouldn’t it [laughing]?}